(2009) Autocross Format Question

[Scany]

Everything happens for a reason. Sometimes the reason is known and sometimes not. I think this thread is great to get some discussion around our events and how they are run. I also don't think we that run it get offended, but rather feel the need to explain why things are the way they are. Because they are that way for a reason. Maybe not always a perfectly good reason, which then may have room for improvement. The "critics" needs to do their argument and the "defendants" needs to do their. Only then will a good solution be able to be built With only one side it's bound to just have change, not necessarily improvement.

[ventsyv]

Just throwing my ideas out there not trying to offend anyone. No need to get defensive.
My point is that it currently takes 2h of organizing for 2h of driving (2 runs for each heat). That's according to the schedule but could be even more if things are delayed. The logistics part can be reduced significantly if it is done before hand. Registration, payments for the event and driver orientation can all be handled online thus leaving only the course walk-through and the inspection for the day of the event.

[KatieT]

Just throwing my ideas out there not trying to offend anyone. No need to get defensive.
My point is that it currently takes 2h of organizing for 2h of driving (2 runs for each heat). That's according to the schedule but could be even more if things are delayed. The logistics part can be reduced significantly if it is done before hand. Registration, payments for the event and driver orientation can all be handled online thus leaving only the course walk-through and the inspection for the day of the event.

I think that it takes much more than 2 hours of organizing for 2 hours of driving, but that's just my opinion. Registration is done before hand but we still need people to check in - otherwise we don't know who is there to split the heat in half. Payment could be online but there would still be people that want to pay cash the day of so we'd still have to give that option. I'd love to say that driver orientation can be done online but I think that it would still need to be done in a driver's meeting. There are just some things that people need to be reminded of (course etiquette, how the grid will work, bringing back loaner helmets, etc. I'd love it if we could cut down on some of the things that take up time but I'm not sure how (and yes, I realize that's what this thread is about). I think more people asking how they can help would be very much appreciated and patience as sometimes there is down time where you just have to wait (when timing is having issues for example - sometimes leaves or bugs will set the lights off and we have to reset it). In the morning once the course is set we ask that people chalk the course as they walk it. In the afternoon we ask that people stack cones so we can gather them up. I do like the idea of more signs so people know what's going on and that's something that we can work on. I think that the guys organizing this are doing a great job - I see lots of the hours put in before an event and it's getting more efficient as the year goes on. My .02...

~Katie

[Car54]

Just throwing my ideas out there not trying to offend anyone. No need to get defensive.
My point is that it currently takes 2h of organizing for 2h of driving (2 runs for each heat). That's according to the schedule but could be even more if things are delayed. The logistics part can be reduced significantly if it is done before hand. Registration, payments for the event and driver orientation can all be handled online thus leaving only the course walk-through and the inspection for the day of the event.

Please stop exclaiming that people are getting defensive as you can't honestly expect there to not be counterpoints.

The logistics you refer to must be handled by people in the evenings, weekends, around their real jobs, on a daily or so basis to perform. Many people are able to give up a day a month to dedicate to the autocross, so that the event can even happen. This forces things to take place the day of because frankly there aren't 15 or even 3 (it's mostly Jonathan) people handling the logistics between events. This is why SO MUCH has to take place the day of, because we have people show up that day to help. So while it's great that people are standing around asking to do something, it's not anticipated, expected, or even required and it can be hard to deal with because you already had roles for the people you have counted on for the whole season/years.

See how it all relates back to volunteers, committed volunteers? And you sit up in the grandstands and can't figure out why people would get defensive when you seem to have all the answers. I wish I could donate more time to the events, but I have other things in life going on....just like everyone else (I think, except for Jonathan ). Maybe when you do more than 1 or 2 events you'll have a better basis and average of experience, until then just sit back, relax, and work on your driving.

[jls8177]

Craig,

No offense, but this is exactly what I'm talking about. I haven't just done 2-3 events, I've been here for three years and offered to help in the past. Actually, I won a season in my class if that means anything.

I'm actually offering to help before the event if you read my original post. All that I have received as far as a direct response, is a PM with some attitude about how difficult the job really is and inquiring how I would like to help. I STATED HOW I WOULD HELP and even backed up some of my ideas with simple solutions. But up to this point I have nobody contacting me to try and carry out my, or anyone other, ideas and make them a reality. Simple ideas to help with volunteers, that I'm willing to handle. Worker assignments, that I'm willing to tackle. Also collecting money from pre-registrants at the canopy when they drive up to avoid the cluster**** at the timing tent for an hour while everyone scratches their head and tries to register. All it takes is a printout!

Anyhow, your reaction is exactly what I'm talking about. People wasting energy being offended and upset when even that 10 minutes it took you to write that, you could have had one more volunteer.

Someone contact me if you want my help.

Jason
jls8177@mac.com
443-306-3540
text, email, phone, PM, reply......anything!

[ventsyv]

I'm a computer programmer. If people want, I can implement an online payment system so payments can be handled beforehand. If you don't want to require people to pre-pay online, you can charge $5 more for "at the spot" to encourage people to pay upfront.

[hoyabmw]

I think part of the problem with the Washington Circuit is the size of the facility. Our PA system doesn't reach those people in the paddock, and being at a lower level, people in the paddock can't see what's going on either. Having registration in the paddock would help,

What happened to the FM transmitter that we started looking for 2 years ago? That will reach to a distant grid no matter what. No PA will reach far enough for everyone to hear on any site we run at.

but I believe our system of one computer for registration AND timing/scoring prevents that from happening.

When and why did this happen? There are (well, were) 2 computers that can be networked and run registration on one. We did this for the past 5+ years with very little problem (ok, I don't know about last year, but for the previous years while I and then Pete were chair, it worked)

As for session splits:

SCCA DC runs 2 sessions with 3 heats each, worker changes are on the fly, and everyone grids at the same time. This requires a facility big enough to handle the traffic, grid and paddock/parking for 300 cars at once, of which FedEx is the only location in the area.

AI runs a similar setup, but only 1 session of 3 heats, and at FedEx grids everyone at once, but at Waldorf they have to shuffle cars into a single grid just like we do, leaving a little downtime. This means everyone is there from 8:00 til 3:00 on average.

Both of those groups have to completely support themselves from the autocross revenues--the events have to be large enough to cover the cost of lot rental, insurance, SCCA mandated charges, and equipment/ancillary costs, all of which are much higher than NCC's costs. Their costs are higher, but not that much. They don't receive the subsidies NCC receives, and as such they have to run more people, which means more efficiency. It can seem daunting to newcomers, but they are preparing people for the insanity of a National series (and the local events are far more professional, polished, and newbie friendly than any national SCCA event)

Last year's numbers were way down for all autox clubs due to the economy and fuel prices, so comparing last year to this year is a little misleading. NCC was easily doing 100-120 regularly 3 years ago.

[KatieT]

There are (well, were) 2 computers that can be networked and run registration on one. We did this for the past 5+ years with very little problem (ok, I don't know about last year, but for the previous years while I and then Pete were chair, it worked)

I believe that there were too many issues with the software last year and getting the two computers to talk to each other so we switched to one computer. All that it means is that we are either doing timing or registering people - just not both. I don't think it's such a bad idea either because at least at Summit point, people have to walk across the grid to get to registration. IMO we haven't had enough people volunteering this year to warrant trying to run two cmoputers - heck...I "learned" timing last event and was then left alone running it because all of the other volunteers that are always there were somewhere else with the approaching storm. If a few people want to start learning the timing system I'm sure the help would be welcome - but it would mean being there at the rest of the events for this year.

~Katie

[Luda]

We did go to one Computer to help reduce computer issues during the event. and it seems to have worked, now we have the occasional timing hiccups, but as far as the computer side goes its been running fairly smoothly this year.

And in response to the Volunteering, its great that people want to help out, but there is only so much that can be done, some things just take time, and it cant be helped. but If you want to help just approach one of the committee members or volunteers around timing and they will direct you to where you can help. We apreciate all the help, and without volunteers the events wouldnt happen.

In regards to pre registration, online pre pay is something to look into, and i think its a great idea and would love to implement it for next season, but the logistics behind it need to be looked into before we do it. And it would allow us to charge more for walk ups to help encourage pre pays. But the idea of eliminating walk ups i dont think is going to fly, we get a decent amount of people who bring there buddies along, or people who werent expecting to go and then found out short notice they could, thus register on the spot, so i think walk ups will be aroundfor a while longer.

We have the FM transmitter, unfortunatly its not in working order at the moment, so it doesnt do us any good.

[1996 328ti]

In regards to pre registration, online pre pay is something to look into, and i think its a great idea and would love to implement it for next season, but the logistics behind it need to be looked into before we do it.

Many chapters use motorsportreg.com and I believe you can export it right into axware if you are still using it.