(2009) Autocross Classing Announced!!!

[mcoupemindy]

...and to be quite frank, after having argued at a previous autox meeting for the SCCA allowances, I'm rather surprised to see that they were taken out.

They were taken out because they were downright confusing ... (reminds me of everything the SCCA does ...) "Either/or" rules are not conductive to bringing in new members and new faces. Simplicity is key to running a successful marque program. We are not the SCCA and never want to be. Our classing system is for us, the NCCBMWCCA, and we will continue to class cars in a way to develop our program and let people enjoy, without overcomplication, the sport of autocross.

[Nick325xiT 5spd]

They were taken out because they were downright confusing ... (reminds me of everything the SCCA does ...) "Either/or" rules are not conductive to bringing in new members and new faces. Simplicity is key to running a successful marque program. We are not the SCCA and never want to be. Our classing system is for us, the NCCBMWCCA, and we will continue to class cars in a way to develop our program and let people enjoy, without overcomplication, the sport of autocross.

It is? What's so complicated about saying "if you're an SCCA Stock competitor, you go here, otherwise, read the following?"

[mcoupemindy]

It is? What's so complicated about saying "if you're an SCCA Stock competitor, you go here, otherwise, read the following?"

It's an either/or rule - see again my previous post.

SCCA stock is NOT stock ... that's the point. We felt that a fully prepared "Stock" SCCA vehicle is best suited to our Modified category. And if you don't want to run Modified, put street tires on it and run it in Tuner.

[Nick325xiT 5spd]

It's an either/or rule - see again my previous post.

SCCA stock is NOT stock ... that's the point. We felt that a fully prepared "Stock" SCCA vehicle is best suited to our Modified category. And if you don't want to run Modified, put street tires on it and run it in Tuner.

On what basis? An SCCA Stock car will run the same times as an SCCA ST car, and a fully built "Tuner" car will be faster than an SCCA ST car. I mean, unlimited intake manifolds? Really? I get that you guys wanted to allow M50 swaps, but that is not how you should word it. Full spherical bearings? Carbon fiber body panels? I mean, hell, the rules as they are written currently allow you to make massive changes in suspension geometry (track width, roll center, bump steer - you know, custom front control arms).

[mcoupemindy]

On what basis? An SCCA Stock car will run the same times as an SCCA ST car, and a fully built "Tuner" car will be faster than an SCCA ST car. I mean, unlimited intake manifolds? Really? I get that you guys wanted to allow M50 swaps, but that is not how you should word it. Full spherical bearings? Carbon fiber body panels? I mean, hell, the rules as they are written currently allow you to make massive changes in suspension geometry (track width, roll center, bump steer - you know, custom front control arms).

Nick, if you know everything, then please, run the program ...

[woodym3]

On what basis? An SCCA Stock car will run the same times as an SCCA ST car, and a fully built "Tuner" car will be faster than an SCCA ST car. I mean, unlimited intake manifolds? Really? I get that you guys wanted to allow M50 swaps, but that is not how you should word it. Full spherical bearings? Carbon fiber body panels? I mean, hell, the rules as they are written currently allow you to make massive changes in suspension geometry (track width, roll center, bump steer - you know, custom front control arms).

I seriously doubt any of us will be spending the bucks to fully build a "Tuner" car for NCC autocrossing. The intent is to capture as many members as possible who have done normal changes to their cars for fun street and driver school use. Many SCCA autocross (Solo) competitors are far more serious, aspire to National level competition in other parts of the country, and often trailer their "stock" cars to events. But you knew that, right Nick?

[JimHarris]

Nice to see NCC move the MINI into its main line classes after all this time.

I ran mine for two years in X Class, and then sold the car, so it's too late for me, but a nice break for other competitors. Autoxing is more fun when you can compete for something.

Cheers,

Jim Harris

[Bob]

It's an either/or rule - see again my previous post.

SCCA stock is NOT stock ... that's the point. We felt that a fully prepared "Stock" SCCA vehicle is best suited to our Modified category. And if you don't want to run Modified, put street tires on it and run it in Tuner.

Amen, The SCCA "stock" class rules got bent so badly over the years that a new "stock" class was created, the ST groups, with a tire treadwear restriction. btw, we prefer to be called enthusiasts, not "wackjobs"!lol

[mcoupemindy]

btw, we prefer to be called enthusiasts, not "wackjobs"!lol

I corrected my previous post JUST for you ...

[Biggins]

There is no way to make everyone happy with all the different classing systems of SCCA, NASA, NCC, BMWCCA National, etc. whether the competition be club, pro racing or autocross. I agree it was convenient that the old system allowed an ST and an SCCA "stock" car in the same class, but I think this system will be more novice-friendly. In my opinion, most novices with NCC do not initially run SCCA events. Many of us do regularly run SCCA, but I don't see the need to explicity follow the SCCA model.

I only have a few tweaks I would have liked to seen within the "Tuner" class. I don't exactly agree with prohibiting fixed back seats and only allowing bolt in rollbars, and I don't agree with no rear coilovers. However, my car has none of those modifications which makes it irrelevant for me.

I'm also anxious to see how close the times are this season for Group 1 and Group 2 cars.

Let's just have the season begin and see how things go!

[Nick325xiT 5spd]

There is no way to make everyone happy with all the different classing systems of SCCA, NASA, NCC, BMWCCA National, etc. whether the competition be club, pro racing or autocross. I agree it was convenient that the old system allowed an ST and an SCCA "stock" car in the same class, but I think this system will be more novice-friendly. In my opinion, most novices with NCC do not initially run SCCA events. Many of us do regularly run SCCA, but I don't see the need to explicity follow the SCCA model.

I only have a few tweaks I would have liked to seen within the "Tuner" class. I don't exactly agree with prohibiting fixed back seats and only allowing bolt in rollbars, and I don't agree with no rear coilovers. However, my car has none of those modifications which makes it irrelevant for me.

I'm also anxious to see how close the times are this season for Group 1 and Group 2 cars.

Let's just have the season begin and see how things go!

No fixed back seats is a silly rule. All you need to do is specify a minimum seat weight.

Rear coilovers should not be allowed in any class that does not allow for massive reinforcement of the rear suspension mount points.

[SamB325es]

I have done the SCCA thing with Autocrossers-inc and SCCA. I have more fun in the BMWCCA events.
Classing is somewhat irrelevant. If you want to win national championships than concentrate on SCCA and come practice with BMWCCA. If you are worried about winning the NCCBMWCCA autocross championship and feel cheated by the classing check your priorities.
My $.02.

[mcoupemindy]

I have done the SCCA thing with Autocrossers-inc and SCCA. I have more fun in the BMWCCA events.
Classing is somewhat irrelevant. If you want to win national championships than concentrate on SCCA and come practice with BMWCCA. If you are worried about winning the NCCBMWCCA autocross championship and feel cheated by the classing check your priorities.
My $.02.

Thanks

[gbauer]

Thanks

can't you just put me in a class all by myself so I win a trophy this year?

[mcoupemindy]

can't you just put me in a class all by myself so I win a trophy this year?

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