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View Full Version : Estimate for body work Part II



2000_328ci
03-11-2006, 12:14 PM
OK, so today I went over, after being recomended to them by guys in the BMW CCA, to Master Crafters off of Rockville Pike. They talked with me about the mods I wanted to have painted and installed, discussed the quality of the parts, their fitment, and their durability, and then discussed the difficulty involved with this type of "custom work" and the troubles that he has had in the past with "kits". Fortunately for me, I sat down and did all this discussing with the owner of the shop, Kenny, and he was really straight up with me. He told me that his shop typically does work on collision cars, dealing with oem parts, and insurance companies. BUT, at his older shop, they did massive amounts of work on import cars (both euro and asian) and has delt on numerous occasions with body kits (mainly fiberglass) and has been down that road.

He told me that the last time he did a full fiberglass kit, he had a guy with an RX7 which he tracked and wanted to have the fiberglass kit put on the reduce weight for track purposes. The customer told him that the kit was a complete bolt on replacement for the oem parts and that it would just be an on/off job. 4 weeks later, a bunch of phone calls to manufacturers, etc, the customer told him that he heard the reinforcement bar had to be taken off the front (something he legally wouldn't do due to insurance/suing). The customer yelled at him, blamed his shop for the work, etc and he said he wouldn't do another kit like that at his shop.

After talking with him about my parts and letting him know that the front bumper, mirrors, and front bumper add on were all oem like direct replacements made from oem poly material, he agreed to do a test fit. He is also going to line up the fiberglass rear add on and test fir the fiberglass sideskirts and in the event that they come out as well as I have been lead to believe, he will do the work. That being said, here is his price schedule...

Body labor (12.8 hours at 38 an hour) $486.40
Paint labor (13.4 hours at 38 an hour) $509.20
Paint supplies (13.4 hours at 24 an hour) $321.60
Sublet/misc. 11.00
Subtotal $1333.20
Sales tax 323.60 @<hidden> 5% $16.63
Grand total $1349.83 (painted and installed)


When compared to wagon works, they say it will take them around half the time and will cost me less per hour of work.

What do you guys think?

Also, last night at an eastcoasteuro.net meet, I talked with a guy who owns a shop in Landsdown who said that Kenny over at Master Crafters is good but not great in his opinion. Was this guy just trying to promote his own shops work or do you think he had a point. I have decided that wagon works is simply out of the question due to the price tag and for that reason, want the second best people to do the work (assuming they are more reasonably priced)... I want to go over to Springfield and have them write up an estimate but given my classes 4 days a week and work the other 3, I never have time during "regular business hours" to make it over there. :(

OwnedbyDuncan
03-11-2006, 04:36 PM
Check out the other guys work. Then check out Wagonwork. Reason the others guys pay their help less because they aren't as good as Wagonworks. You get what you pay for. Wagonwowrks is the best in the area bar none. If you are one of the best bodyman or painters in the area where are you going to work? Someday some will expalin to me how bodyshops price their work and still make a profit. $38 per hour or whatever doesn''t make any sense when for mechanical work the going rate averages about a $100 an hour.

Have used Wagonwork for 16 years and wouldn't use anyone else.

Dave Apker

SharkD
03-11-2006, 04:49 PM
Dave, he already had an aneurism over the original quote from Wagonworks (http://www.nccbmwcca.org/forum/showthread.php?t=1612).

BTW, Chase, it's usually a good idea to continue your discussion in the original thread (http://www.nccbmwcca.org/forum/showthread.php?t=1583) that you created... or the follow-on thread (http://www.nccbmwcca.org/forum/showthread.php?t=1612)...

It makes life much easier for those searching for the same thing later on, and either way, it has no effect on your post count.

2000_328ci
03-11-2006, 04:56 PM
Dave, he already had an aneurism over the original quote from Wagonworks (http://www.nccbmwcca.org/forum/showthread.php?t=1612).

BTW, Chase, it's usually a good idea to continue your discussion in the original thread (http://www.nccbmwcca.org/forum/showthread.php?t=1583) that you created... or the follow-on thread (http://www.nccbmwcca.org/forum/showthread.php?t=1612)...

It makes life much easier for those searching for the same thing later on, and either way, it has no effect on your post count.
oh this wasn't intended to increase the post count i assure you... i simply didn't think anyone would read through the whole thing if i simply added onto my other thread...


and yes, I had a dilema with wagon work... i want to use them but they want more than twice the going rate of almost every other shop in the area (they want 2500 for the work). I am sure they are the best and do not deny that.. i simply am trying to figure out who the second best is (and hope they are more reasonably priced)... i can't afford to spend that much money and am simply looking for an alternative.

white_2kgt
03-13-2006, 03:35 PM
I've not had any work done at either place, but I have had a lot of body work done to vehicles in the past. Let me tell you, there is NOTHING worse than looking at your car, your project, each and every day and seeing SOMETHING you don't like. With body/paint work that you are paying someone else to do, it is usually a one shot deal or you start over from scratch, which means big $$$. I don't know your situation, but 1k difference for this type of work doesn't seem like a lot to me to get 'the best' person in town to do it, especially if they have experience in doing this sort of thing.

Now that I have a race car it gets quite a bit of body work done. I go with the cheaper places to get it done because it really doesn't matter to me anymore, and believe me, you can tell a difference.

Barry
03-13-2006, 05:55 PM
YOU WROTE:
"That being said, here is his price schedule...
Body labor (12.8 hours at 38 an hour) $486.40
Paint labor (13.4 hours at 38 an hour) $509.20
Paint supplies (13.4 hours at 24 an hour) $321.60
Sublet/misc. 11.00
Subtotal $1333.20
Sales tax 323.60 @<hidden> 5% $16.63
Grand total $1349.83 (painted and installed)
When compared to wagon works, they say it will take them around half the time and will cost me less per hour of work."

Go get another quote from Springfield Auto Body.
Tell them I referred you, and then you'll have more data points,
upon which to base your decision.
Barry

2000_328ci
03-18-2006, 03:12 PM
is this the body shop you are talking about... http://www.springfieldautobody.com/

Barry
03-18-2006, 03:36 PM
is this the body shop you are talking about... http://www.springfieldautobody.com/


Yes.
Have you talked to them?
If not, you should talk only to Jim Scott, or Jim Amery.
Barry

2000_328ci
03-22-2006, 11:24 AM
Just another data point. I just had a bumper refinished at Master Crafters (rear ended by a minivan of course, would have avoided damage except for the minivan front license plate screw heads) and the service and work were excellent. And GEICO (the other party's insurance co.) even provided a really crappy rental car at Enterprise next door. I would not hesitate to use Master Crafters again, but hope I don't need to.

Vic
thats good to hear... i guess i will go to springfield auto body, get an estimate, compare their operations with master crafters and then see who seems like a better deal (quality/price).

PS. did kenny at master crafters do the work for you?

2000_328ci
03-25-2006, 01:19 PM
OH, one of the nice things about his shop was that he indicated that he was going to do the work himself and had a lot of experiance with kits :confused:

Oh well, I have to come up with a shop and soon.... One more week before I make my final decision, take all the parts to the shop, drop off the car, wait a couple days, take lots of pics, wite up and article, and write the big check

bmwracr
03-28-2006, 02:35 PM
I have been using Master Crafters for 15 years and have no complaints. They do good work and it's always done when they say it will be.

Dan

2000_328ci
04-04-2006, 04:26 PM
I have been using Master Crafters for 15 years and have no complaints. They do good work and it's always done when they say it will be.

Dan
master crafters refused to do the work after seeing the pieces and told me they wouldn't do it as it would require to much custom work... but, kenny told me that he knew the best shop in town for custom stuff... (i later learned how he knew they were so good....)

OK, so today I visited YET ANOTHER body shop. This time, I went to Euro Pro out in Gaithersburg (exit 11 on 270). The guys who own the shop are former wagon works employees, bought their own shop, and have the "latest" in technology to do the work.

They looked at the pieces (i brought everything except the skirts) and they said that for the front bumper, rear add on, skirts, m3 mirrors, front lip, and to fix the rear spoiler, they wanted about 2500. They didn't write up a full estimate but that was the guys ballpark (the tech I spoke with is one of the co-owners).

They said that my spoiler was absolutely terrible but were very confident they could produce night-and-day results and make it look much better. They also said that they could make the following pieces look X% of the oem finish...

Front bumper = 70% oem look
Rear add on = 85% oem look
Skirts = 90% oem look
M3 mirrors = 100% oem look
Front lip = 90-100% oem look
Rear spoiler= 80% oem look

They told me that the front bumper may have a few sweeping waves (compared it to my acs rear spoiler) but said that where my acs spoiler had a waviness effect, the waves on the front bumper when they are done will be so minimal that to the naked eye they won't even be noticable.

They are confident that the car would look absolutely impecable and are confident that they can do the best job in the DC metro area (even better than wagon works) and the price they want is comparable with wagon works (whos price didn't include fixing the acs 3 piece).

Further, they said that they would 100% stand behind their work and if anything comes out not as described they would fix it... BUT, they said that it won't happen as they do everything right the first time and don't mess around with "fixing things later". In fact, in their shop, they had two clients cars who had work done at different shps (one of which was master crafters as mentioned above) who complained that the work wasn't up to par and the cars had been brought there to fix them.

Overall, the price is going to be insanely high and i originally didn't want to spend anywhere near 2 grand, yet alone above it. But my mom is willing to pick up 1/3 or so of the tab as a college graduation present and with the 1000 i have in the bank, the 600 i have on my debit card, and the 450 i have coming in via taxes (plus the 500 every other week for working weekends), i figure i will just pay up the big bucks now to make sure everything gets done right from the start.

They don't have an available time to begin work for about a week or two but thursday i am going up so they can look at the sideskirts and given that they are confident in their orignal estimate (the one they are doing tonight), we will begin as soon as they have an opening. Overall, the work will take a full week or so and I have to leave the car there so they can make sure the fitment is perfect and what not but they said that it will look impecable when done.

I am actually excited about spending a lot of money... this is bizzare but i am excited to have finally figured out who will do the work and am pleased to say i am confident they will do a superb job.

Within a month or so, it will finalllllllly be done :)




oh and as this project (including parts paint and install) will have cost me over 5 thousand bucks in total.... darn the car obsession :(

Braven
02-03-2009, 09:58 PM
just take the car to jeff shaws and have it done right

Nick325xiT 5spd
02-04-2009, 01:34 PM
Master crafters has done some fairly mediocre paint work for me in the past.

Do you really feel strongly about covering your car with fiberglass? I've not seen one yet that didn't make me want to retch. It's very tough and very expensive to do this sort of thing right, and the fiberglass stuff is purely made to hit a price point since anyone who cares about weight today is going to go carbon fiber anyway. (And really, CF isn't much, if any, better.)

Car54
02-04-2009, 09:24 PM
With such a great economy currently, you should be able to afford the extra for a job done right...


oh the good ole days...