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mduhovich
04-19-2009, 11:50 AM
I was thinking about buying a helmet. Just cancelled the previous order after realizing that I ordered a wrong one.

As I understand I should buy Snell either M or SA rating. Any suggestions on a particular brand, place to buy from?
I am looking for a cheap one:)

Scany
04-19-2009, 11:54 AM
Visit OG Racing out by Dulles. You get to try them on and their prices are good. I got a Bell closed helmet and a G-Force open. Both very good.

mduhovich
04-19-2009, 12:11 PM
Scany, thank you for the advice. However, it sounds like a long drive from Frederick, MD

mf44
04-19-2009, 01:06 PM
Scany, thank you for the advice. However, it sounds like a long drive from Frederick, MD

I think it would be worth it. Every helmet manufacturer fits a slightly different shape, so trying them on in person is really a necessity.

Also, when I first got mine, I was surprised as to how tight it was supposed to fit in certain areas, so it really helps to have someone who knows how it should fit and feel.

ronh21
04-19-2009, 01:46 PM
Scany, thank you for the advice. However, it sounds like a long drive from Frederick, MD

It's only about 45 minutes, which seems well worth it considering that you'll be able to try on several different models. They're open on weekends if it helps. It seems a lot better than the swapping that was going on at the school yesterday.

Ron

1996 328ti
04-19-2009, 04:54 PM
Also try it on in the car you will be driving if you are able.

Reach
04-19-2009, 05:00 PM
Brian Hair and the people at OG are fantastic and will go the extra mile to help you. I've rented and now purchased my helmets from them and the in-stock selection is great. I too was nervous to buy one online for fitment reasons, and was relieved to see such a big stock to find one that worked for me. Price was excellent as well.

As a plus, they've got tons of Sparco racing seats you can sit in and dream about in your car.

Zchild
04-19-2009, 05:06 PM
Does OG Racing offer a club discount, I need a helmet prior to the end of May for school. I like the idea of being able to try it on before I purchase. Thanks...

woodym3
04-19-2009, 06:04 PM
The ability to try on different models and sizes is invaluable. OG Racing is not that far from Frederick using Rt 15 and the Dulles Greenway. Brian is there some Saturdays too. Call him and find out when.
www.ogracing.com 703-430-3303.

1996 328ti
04-19-2009, 06:12 PM
Does OG Racing offer a club discount, I need a helmet prior to the end of May for school. I like the idea of being able to try it on before I purchase. Thanks...

Probably everyone of their customers belong to a club of one or another.
You can't beat them for service. They have also been a long time advertiser <I think> and I believe they also advertise in Roundel.

You might just want to rent a helmet for your first time.
I still buy what I need from them.

Zchild
04-19-2009, 07:08 PM
Probably everyone of their customers belong to a club of one or another.
You can't beat them for service. They have also been a long time advertiser <I think> and I believe they also advertise in Roundel.

You might just want to rent a helmet for your first time.
I still buy what I need from them.
:confused: Is that a yes or a no!

mduhovich
04-19-2009, 07:14 PM
thanks all.. I'm going there next Sunday.

1996 328ti
04-19-2009, 07:17 PM
:confused: Is that a yes or a no!
I guess ask you need to ask Brian then.
All their customers are club members.
PCA, BMW, Audi, MB, SCCA, etc.
They support the club.
What does a discount really mean anyway when they already have good prices?

AG
04-19-2009, 07:24 PM
thanks all.. I'm going there next Sunday.

I don't think they're open on Sunday. Another option is to visit the OG store at Summit Point on the day of the next auto-x, though they may not have a full selection of helmets there.

Zchild
04-19-2009, 07:26 PM
I guess ask you need to ask Brian then.
All their customers are club members.
PCA, BMW, Audi, MB, SCCA, etc.
They support the club.
What does a discount really mean anyway when they already have good prices?
:cool: SafeRacer.com offers the same exact prices for the same helmets as OG Racing, I'm just trying to get the best value for my money.

Munchenman2
04-20-2009, 12:34 AM
mduhovich,

I didn't notice any responses with the following information: make sure your helmet has a 2005 Snell (Foundation) sticker, and it is marked "SA", not "M". The only certification worth considering is the Snell Foundation sticker. Any other certification, no matter how impressive sounding, should be considered as a Waving Red Flag (unless the helmet also has the current Snell sticker as well.)

If in any $ doubt, also please consider how much you, your family, and your friends value the health of your skull and all its contents. If the price of a Bell or similar Snell-certified helmet seems excessive, ask a racer to explain why.

Closed (full-face) helmets provide excellent protection; with an open-face helmet you can receive a horrendous injury to your teeth, jaw, etc by simply impacting your (e.g.) steering wheel.

Note that Snell is not a marque of helmet, but a certification that certain helmets (Bell and several others) have met the latest Snell Foundation safety requirements (which are the safest you can meet).

By no means am I an expert on drivers schools, but I believe that the "M" designation stands for motorcycle use, and the "M" safety requirements are designed for protecting your head from hitting the (e.g.) pavement with only one major hit.

The "SA" refers to Special Applications (including all motorsports events), and the "SA" safety requirements are designed for protecting your head and its contents from multiple major blows, such as you might get from hard parts of the inside of your car if your car were to roll over.

The Snell sticker year is very important, both economically and for safety reasons. Although there is no published standard, the Snell certification standards have been promulgated and the Snell stickers labeled every five years (e.g. 1990, 1995, 2000, 2005), and most people assume that the next iteration will be 2010. Therefore if you buy a Snell 2005 SA, you will have the very best safety protection.

If the Snell Foundation runs true to historical patterns, you can expect them to promulgate upgraded safety requirements in 2010, and major helmet manufacturers will begin selling helmets with a Snell 2010 sticker next year. Many organizations will allow you to use a Snell stickered helmet that is current or only one iteration old. In other words, within 12 months expect safety-conscious motorsports organizers to permit you to use only a Snell 2010 or a Snell 2005. That's where the economic part of your buying decision comes in. There will be many sources from which you can buy a Snell 2000, Snell 1995, etc helmet at a discount. They'll protect you very well if you fall down the stairs, but they may not be used in many sanctioned motorsports events.

More than you wanted to read, right?

Please adhere to the old MG motto: "Safety Fast!"

Sincerely,
Alan :tongue:
Your faithful DIY chair & safety nut

mduhovich
04-20-2009, 06:32 AM
I don't think they're open on Sunday. Another option is to visit the OG store at Summit Point on the day of the next auto-x, though they may not have a full selection of helmets there.
Thank you for mentioning that! We have the Spring Tour this upcoming Saturday, so the only option available was Sunday. I guess I can try visiting that store at Summit Point, or alternatively just have one more autocross without my own helmet.

Zcruizer
04-20-2009, 08:45 AM
I guess ask you need to ask Brian then.
All their customers are club members.
PCA, BMW, Audi, MB, SCCA, etc.
They support the club.
What does a discount really mean anyway when they already have good prices?

A discount means "LESS MONEY!", period. Don't diminish the value of savings because you may have money falling out of your pocket. This club uses retailer's business practices to sell memberships and is a win-win situation. Someone asking for a club discount should be expected and accepted.

Biggins
04-20-2009, 09:38 AM
"M" helmets are fine for autocross (open or full face). In fact, there are plenty of "M" helmets designed specifically for autocrossers. There are many "SA" helmets that are overkill for autocross. However, if you think you might do a track event at any point in the future, buy a closed face "SA2005."

That said, I would not and have never skimped on safety equipment. I have a full face "SA" helmet because I have done track events. I'd actually much prefer an open face helmet for autocross, and I've even removed the visor on my full.

I bought my helmet from soloracer.com only because I had a gift certificate. Otherwise, I would have bought from OG Racing which is where I'll buy my next one. I definitely would not expect OG to offer a club discount because the ONLY people who shop there are members of some club (SCCA, NASA, PCA, BMW, Mazda, M-B, etc.). They could never charge full price for anyone. Their prices are quite fair.

Zchild
04-20-2009, 10:51 AM
"M" helmets are fine for autocross (open or full face). In fact, there are plenty of "M" helmets designed specifically for autocrossers. There are many "SA" helmets that are overkill for autocross. However, if you think you might do a track event at any point in the future, buy a closed face "SA2005."

That said, I would not and have never skimped on safety equipment. I have a full face "SA" helmet because I have done track events. I'd actually much prefer an open face helmet for autocross, and I've even removed the visor on my full.

I bought my helmet from soloracer.com only because I had a gift certificate. Otherwise, I would have bought from OG Racing which is where I'll buy my next one. I definitely would not expect OG to offer a club discount because the ONLY people who shop there are members of some club (SCCA, NASA, PCA, BMW, Mazda, M-B, etc.). They could never charge full price for anyone. Their prices are quite fair.
Let me get an understanding of what you're saying... For Diriver's School events I need a closed face SA2005 helmet and not an open faced SA2005 helmet because that's not what I understand from the FAQ section of Driver's School. It only states SA2005 helmet not specifically open or closed face. Thanks in advance.

Biggins
04-20-2009, 11:16 AM
Let me get an understanding of what you're saying... For Diriver's School events I need a closed face SA2005 helmet and not an open faced SA2005 helmet because that's not what I understand from the FAQ section of Driver's School. It only states SA2005 helmet not specifically open or closed face. Thanks in advance.
I have not done an NCC track event (only with other clubs), so I cannot give you a definite answer, but an open face "SA" should be acceptable for track days. I have definitely seen other students/drivers with open face helmets at the track for certain events.

When I was shopping, I only considered a full face and feel much safer in a full face for track days. I only felt comfortable having a full face; you may prefer the open face.

It is mainly preference in design and fit, but I did not consider an open face helmet at all. I had few options for my full face since I wear eyeglasses. I would just say buy the most comfortable and "safest" helmet that you can afford. Try to consider it as a mod to your car rather than an added obligatory expense. I find it ironic that people spend $1k on a new exhaust, suspension, etc. and hesitate to spend more than $200 on safety equipment.

mduhovich
04-20-2009, 11:24 AM
I find it ironic that people spend $1k on a new exhaust, suspension, etc. and hesitate to spend more than $200 on safety equipment.
That probably makes sence to buy an expensive one for track, but autocross.. ? I am not sure about it..

1996 328ti
04-20-2009, 11:59 AM
Let me get an understanding of what you're saying... For Diriver's School events I need a closed face SA2005 helmet and not an open faced SA2005 helmet because that's not what I understand from the FAQ section of Driver's School. It only states SA2005 helmet not specifically open or closed face. Thanks in advance.
I think he is suggesting a full faced helmet.
The minimum standard is actually SA2000 or M2000 until the 2010s are available for 1 year.

Munchenman2
04-20-2009, 12:16 PM
Zach et al,

We all expect to be the safest drivers that we can be, even in 'competitive' environments. Even in the safe environment of a private circuit like those at Summit Point, how many times have you heard of someone becoming involved in a head-banging incident caused by:


another driver's error?
ice, oil, dust, gravel, or other 'debris' on the track?
hitting an animal at speed?
sudden mechanical failure?
off-circuit excursions onto natural terrain?
into-the-woods excursions?
using OEM or lap belts only?
many other examples?
NCC runs the safest schools around, and yet we have had each of these incidents happen at driver education events.

I cannot overstate my opinion that a full face helmet is going to provide vastly superior protection to an open face helmet.

Sincerely,

Alan :tongue:
Full-Face Morgan Occasional AutoCrosser

Biggins
04-20-2009, 01:25 PM
That probably makes sence to buy an expensive one for track, but autocross.. ? I am not sure about it..
If you know for sure you're only doing autocross, these would be cheaper options for an "M" helmet:
http://www.gforce.com/products/helmets/3000.php
http://www.pyrotect.com/product.php?productid=54&cat=14&page=2

If any chance of track events, these would be cheaper options for an open face "SA" helmet:
http://www.gforce.com/products/helmets/3001.php
http://www.pyrotect.com/product.php?productid=50&cat=14&page=1 (http://www.pyrotect.com/product.php?productid=50&cat=14&page=1)

However, as I said before, I suggest a full face "SA" helmet if there is any chance of doing track events. If you're positive you'll only do autocrosses, an open face "M" helmet will do the trick.

mduhovich
04-20-2009, 02:13 PM
Biggins, thanks for the links. The first one looks like one of the loaner helmets. :)

mcoupemindy
04-20-2009, 02:55 PM
If you know for sure you're only doing autocross, these would be cheaper options for an "M" helmet:
http://www.gforce.com/products/helmets/3000.php
http://www.pyrotect.com/product.php?productid=54&cat=14&page=2

If any chance of track events, these would be cheaper options for an open face "SA" helmet:
http://www.gforce.com/products/helmets/3001.php
http://www.pyrotect.com/product.php?productid=50&cat=14&page=1 (http://www.pyrotect.com/product.php?productid=50&cat=14&page=1)

However, as I said before, I suggest a full face "SA" helmet if there is any chance of doing track events. If you're positive you'll only do autocrosses, an open face "M" helmet will do the trick.

Don't forget about HJC Snell Motorcycle Open Face helmets. Check www.helmetcity.com has some for a very cheap option.

Ethan Blank
04-20-2009, 03:36 PM
+1 for helmetcity.com. I used them, they had the best price at the time for a quality helmet.

While a quality helmet is important for Auto-X, I think it's essential for track events.

woodym3
04-20-2009, 06:33 PM
Let me get an understanding of what you're saying... For Diriver's School events I need a closed face SA2005 helmet and not an open faced SA2005 helmet because that's not what I understand from the FAQ section of Driver's School. It only states SA2005 helmet not specifically open or closed face. Thanks in advance.
As stated in the Drivers School FAQ, the minimum standard is an open face M 2000. Helmets with a 2000 sticker are probably no longer available through legitimate retailers.

You may not have any immediate plans to do an on-track drivers school, but your interests may change. The original poster may not want to cover up that pretty face, and the chances of injury in an incident are extremely rare, but why take a chance. For a few dollars more, get a full-face SA2005. It'll probably be more than 1 1/2 years before helmets with 2010 ratings are on the market. And there might be no structural differences from 2005s.

Zchild
04-20-2009, 08:28 PM
As stated in the Drivers School FAQ, the minimum standard is an open face M 2000. Helmets with a 2000 sticker are probably no longer available through legitimate retailers.

You may not have any immediate plans to do an on-track drivers school, but your interests may change. The original poster may not want to cover up that pretty face, and the chances of injury in an incident are extremely rare, but why take a chance. For a few dollars more, get a full-face SA2005. It'll probably be more than 1 1/2 years before helmets with 2010 ratings are on the market. And there might be no structural differences from 2005s.
:cool: Thanks Woody, I'm currently planning on Driver's School this year and looking into purchasing a quality helmet. It will be used for both Auto-X and DS therefore I know SA2005/M2000 needs to be my top consideration and it sounds like from the forum that full face is perferred over open faced helmets. I will use this knowledge wisely Obi-Wan.

Car54
04-20-2009, 09:42 PM
Take a look at the HJC full faced SA helmet...very comfortable and on the inexpensive side.

If you go to try on the helmet, try to wear your most likely candidate for 15 minutes or more to make sure your head doesn't throb or that you find it puts pressure in an odd place.

mf44
04-20-2009, 09:43 PM
Take a look at the HJC full faced SA helmet...very comfortable and on the inexpensive side.

If you go to try on the helmet, try to wear your most likely candidate for 15 minutes or more to make sure your head doesn't throb or that you find it puts pressure in an odd place.

Yes, that's the helmet I have. Was one of the more comfortable ones I tried on, and the price was right, too.

mcoupemindy
04-22-2009, 07:28 PM
Take a look at the HJC full faced SA helmet...very comfortable and on the inexpensive side.

If you go to try on the helmet, try to wear your most likely candidate for 15 minutes or more to make sure your head doesn't throb or that you find it puts pressure in an odd place.

Which HJC Models are SA rated?

mf44
04-22-2009, 07:37 PM
Which HJC Models are SA rated?

http://www.ogracing.com/catalog/1-Driver/24-Helmets/267-HJC-AUTO-RACING-HELMETS-SA2005/268-Helmets

slantsixm3
04-23-2009, 06:34 PM
I'll second Woody's recent comments and add some:
1. while you might see yourself as only an ocasionally autocrosser, having a proper helmet opens the possiblity of doing a driver's school or other event (karting?). I highly recommend trying at least one driver's school, btw. :-)
2. Going to OG takes care of any certifications, specs, etc. that the helmet may need. OG won't sell you one that's wrong for your use. Fitting a helmet might be even more critical for the ladies with smaller (outside) heads, you do not want a helmet that is too big.
3. If you decide this is no fun at all, it's possible to resell a helmet. I would not, however, buy a used helmet myself for several safety-related technical reasons. The helmet you buy now should be good for about 6 yrs before the Snell rating expires, I think.

Do not be so sure the OG racing store at Summit Point is still in business. At the last driver's school the place was closed and all stock removed. Rumor is they had an arms-length relationship with OG and could do as they pleased. OG may know what is happening there, but I don't think they have any control over whether the store is open or not. At least call first.

Car54
04-23-2009, 09:14 PM
Do not be so sure the OG racing store at Summit Point is still in business. At the last driver's school the place was closed and all stock removed. Rumor is they had an arms-length relationship with OG and could do as they pleased. OG may know what is happening there, but I don't think they have any control over whether the store is open or not. At least call first.

Store was open 4/20.

woodym3
04-23-2009, 09:33 PM
Fitting a helmet might be even more critical for the ladies with smaller (outside) heads,

It's a good thing you clarified that Joel.

Nick325xiT 5spd
04-24-2009, 09:19 AM
For conepacking, you'll be kicking yourself down the line for not buying a cheap M rated open face helmet.

a) Closed face helmets increase the risk of neck injuries in cars with airbags.
b) SA rating is designed to protect you from a roll cage - not really useful in a car with an interior.
c) Open face is way more comfortable and doesn't retain heat. Heat exhaustion is a far greater danger in a summer autox than wrecking.
d) Helmets are seriously dubious in cars with modern safety equipment anyway, so you aren't actually buying extra safety when you buy a "better" helmet.

If you are planning to also do DEs down the line, it *may* make sense to buy an SA rated helmet instead. But that's only if you're planning to run with an organization that does not allow M rated helmets.

ronh21
04-24-2009, 09:17 PM
Store was open 4/20.

The lady running the OG store said she was told (by whoever) to be open whenever there's a group on the track. On Monday she dropped by to do paperwork or something and saw there was a group she didn't know about (MBCA) running, so she opened up for a few hours. I don't think I'd go there for a helmet fitting. They definitely stock a small subset of the Dulles store's inventory.

Ron

mduhovich
04-26-2009, 08:06 AM
Thank you, guys, for participating in discussion:) it's very helpful:)