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fpol
01-19-2007, 11:40 AM
What are the Chapter guidelines as to seats? I will be replacing my Vaders for this season, but I'd prefer to go with one of the adjustable seatback seats (ala Recaro Speed or Pole Positions) for the passenger side to retain accessibility to the rear. Will the chapter or Instructors have an issue with this?

If this presents a problem I will have to either go adjustable seats for both sides, or find some other option.

odortiz
01-19-2007, 12:17 PM
both my cars have 2 different seats. one has both sparco non-reclinable. the other has sparco driver seat and stock passenger. bmw's requirements are equal retraints for both. PCA goes a little farther calling seats part of the restraint system. since my m3 has similar seats in front, they are ok with it. i have a really narrow seat for the driver. it would be uncomfortable for most instructors. so they get a wider model.

1996 328ti
01-19-2007, 01:31 PM
What are the Chapter guidelines as to seats? I will be replacing my Vaders for this season, but I'd prefer to go with one of the adjustable seatback seats (ala Recaro Speed or Pole Positions) for the passenger side to retain accessibility to the rear. Will the chapter or Instructors have an issue with this?

If this presents a problem I will have to either go adjustable seats for both sides, or find some other option.
If and when I install seats, I'll have adjustables for both sides.
You should email Bill Shook at onlybmw @<hidden> aol.com.

Roy
01-21-2007, 02:58 PM
At the November 2006 Drivers' School Steering Committee meeting, we had a long discussion about how to apply the concept of "Equal Restraints" for both driver and instructor. I hope everyone knows that NCC requires equal restraints for both driver and passenger, and understands the rationale for this rule.

It was generally agreed that equal means the same. It was also agreed that the seat is part of the occupant restraint system. So, a race seat for the driver, and a stock seat for the instructor, is a definite no-go at NCC schools.

In situations such as David Ortiz' car, where the seats are comparable but not exactly the same model or width, this would be up to the chief instructor to make sure that we are providing equal safety for the instructor. As Steven suggests, contact Bill Shook for definitive guidance.

Speaking from personal experience as an instructor with an E36 M3,
I have found the CG lock, used in conjunction with stock seats and belts, to be quite sufficient for all purposes other for a dedicated race car. I don't see the point of aftermarket seats in a street car, especially if the seats that are being replaced are E36 M3 Vaders.

-Roy Morris
DSSC Chair

odortiz
01-21-2007, 03:34 PM
i found the vaders extremely uncomfortable. it could just be my body composition, because some people find them fine.

fpol
01-23-2007, 08:53 AM
Thanks for the replies. The reason I asked is because I specifically don't want an instructor feeling uncomfortable - being in the car with a stranger is bad enough. I also know that some worry about fixed back seats without a roll bar, and I'd prefer not to have any instructor refuse to ride.

Stock Vaders/restraints however are not acceptable. Both in my first stint at DE ('97 - 98) and now they've provided very ittle support. My last event at VIR, I spent so much time holding myself up by the wheel, that in my last session at T10 I actually had a violent back spasm that ended my day (with close to catastrophic results - it was so violent I could barely turn the wheel, and could only barely limp the car back to paddock). At Shenandoah in May I also experienced back issues though with no consequences. I'm not prone to back problems so it was clearly the lack of support.

I may look at the CG lock again (mine broke in 05 after only a few months use). At the end of the year depending on progress I'll see if a roll bar is necessary - this remains my primary street car.